BattlezM
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Post by BattlezM on Jan 27, 2008 22:51:43 GMT -8
Seeing as Goo Roo has declared there be a thread set up for standard level suggestionz, I thought I'd start it off. Simply post a level that you would nominate for a poll (this is not the actual poll). It may be your level or anyone elsez. Try to pick a level appropriate for the position in the standard set: - Rocky Roadz will have the smallest, easiest levelz while Gruntz in Space will have the biggest, most challenging onez.
- CL must be modified to contain a single warp letter that should correspond to it'z stage (each stage is progressively harder) CL must also have only 2 secretz, that are not required to complete it.
- CLz should have coinz appropriate to their position (no Rocky Road levelz with 100 coinz, as there won't be any Gruntz in Space with just 10) .
- CL must have appropriate tile bondingz, which meanz no partial stairz, incomplete plateauz, switchez placed in poolz, rockz that cover part of poolz or plateauz, improperly transferring alternate ground tilez.
- CL should be well decorated, if the map is too empty or containz open areaz, it must be "spruced up".
- Logicz must be proper, absolutely no switchez that behave like secret onez. There can also be only 1 warpstone and should correspond to it'z proper color in the stage.
- Help notez should be placed in the lower levelz if possible.
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BattlezM
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Post by BattlezM on Jan 27, 2008 22:53:24 GMT -8
I think that my "Follow the Leader" should be about Stage 2 for Gruntziclez. BTW: We definitely need a Gunter CL for this seriez, but not Water World.
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Post by ILoveGruntz on Jan 28, 2008 0:15:07 GMT -8
Here is a few more demands: 1: No odd graphics (stairs in the middle of nowhere, switchez placed in water or hazard without a proper "island") 2: Two secretz, a warp and a switch. (that is how the game was intended) 3: proper !-notez (this will be tricky) - if they are meant to be played like standard levelz. This means that most CL'z need to be modified (at least with !-notez), to be used, but i really think that these are the requirements to pass. I think that the last level (level 32) should be made especially for this project. Why not make it as common CL, for all the designerz Edit: Sorry forgot to say: I think that my Border Post will do well as level 30 As to other levels i don't know. Many CL'z are made as experimentz, and are not usable as standard levelz. Some of Swordgruntz and Alexandgruntz CL'z might be good choicez for the middle to high graphic setz, whereas Gaby'z CL'z mostly contain odd graphicz, and can't be used here. We could also make some training levelz as well.
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GooRoo
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Post by GooRoo on Jan 28, 2008 6:02:12 GMT -8
One other requirement of a candidate "Standard Level" is that it not be necessary to find a SecretTeleporterTrigger ( ) or in order to acquire something (or go somewhere) in order to complete the level. Those thingz should only exist for the purpose of achieving a " PERFECT!" score ... for the (single) Warp letter, or for Coinz. This is not to say that multiple Wormholez would prevent a CL from being used as a "Gruntz 2" 'Standard Level'. For example, without the multiple Secretz, "Knight's Tour" could be included, replacing Secretz with ordinary Teleporterz.
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Gaby
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Post by Gaby on Jan 28, 2008 9:41:07 GMT -8
IMHO none of the series (e.g. 'Stargate', 'The Cross', 'MGS-' etc.) is appropriate to be in the New Standard Levelz ... I designed my CLz to be CLz and therefore I have all 4 warp letterz... BTW ILoveGruntz I'm proud with my designz and do no think they contain odd graphicz, they are different I admit, but that's because I think that the game can be aesthetic too...
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Post by SwordGrunt on Jan 28, 2008 10:10:34 GMT -8
The graphicz may look odd in details, but the imagez Gaby 'generatez' in the mini-map are always amazing. It isn't simple to do those, no, it isn't and requirez much effort. Now on-topic. Those 'different tile combinationz' should be avoided, yes. Personally, I think that my Space Station Beta (Puzzle Arena) could be Level 2 or 3 of Gruntz In Space. Perhapz ToyLandVI would do in the Kitchen world, as level 4. However, everyone should remember that the name of the CL will not be displayed as the SL name! Gruntz is programmed to have distinct names for the SLz, and the .wwd filez named "LEVEL1","LEVEL2" etc. So the third Gruntziclez level should have a Grunt left stuck somewhere because of its name. I know, people wouldn't care much, but it'1d look a bit odd.
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Reece
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Post by Reece on Jan 28, 2008 10:48:13 GMT -8
I think that my 'The sweet and the sour' should be in level 1, 2 or 3 (preferebly 1) of the high on sweets stage. Its size and difficulty fits perfectly for them stages. Toying around would be a great one too! P.S. I would not like any of my 'a club round the head' series in the new level lineup as all the designs for this tri octology are set as easy and quick (but enjoyable!)
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Post by SwordGrunt on Jan 29, 2008 6:47:08 GMT -8
The idea of creating the last level is very good. I was thinking of making a Space Station Delta -- The Final Castle, which would actually fit into this. All Designerz should help as well (of course, if they want), so it will be a 'Global' CL/SL.
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GooRoo
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Post by GooRoo on Jan 29, 2008 7:34:23 GMT -8
Instead of re-hashing existing Custom Levelz for a "Gruntz 2" REZ file, perhapz we should consider creating new CLz specifically for the new REZ file. The CLz should be designed following the format (and 'rulez') of the original "Standard Levelz" ... - Stage 1 easiest; Stage 4 hardest
- 1 (and only 1) Warp letter
- 1 (and only 1)
- Secret will only allow the solver to acquire either Coinz or the Warp letter (not Tool/Toy or other object necessary to complete the puzzle)
- Coin 'rewardz' something like 2 for Stage 1 (Rocky Roadz), 4 for Stage 2, 6 for Stage 3 and 8 for Stage 4. "Gruntziclez" startz with a higher number of Coinz, say 3 and addz that number for each Stage ... and so on. "Gruntziclez" Stage 1 should be approximately as difficult as "Rocky Roadz" Stage 2 (and so on). Each Stage more difficult than the one preceeding it in the graphicz area, then easing up for the next graphicz area a bit.
- Stage 1 openz with one Grunt, Stage 2 with 2, et cetera. "Gruntz In Space" Stage 4 endz with 15 Gruntz required at some point in time ... perhapz another "Final Battle".
- The 'theme' (and perhapz, the Title) of the original 'Standard' Levelz retained in the new set of puzzlez (with '2' added).
I have completed Statz Page imagez for "Rocky Roadz" through "High Rollerz" and will be uploading them to the web host, but do not have time right now to link them in. When I return home from my doctor's appointment, I will link them in. Those Statz Pagez should serve to give prospective Designer patricipantz an idea of what to put in their new version. After linking, I will resume the project with "Honey, I Shrunk The Gruntz" through 'Gruntz In Space". After that is done, I will begin considering what role I might play in creating a CL for "Gruntz 2".
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Reece
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Post by Reece on Jan 29, 2008 8:30:42 GMT -8
But in RR stage 4, the secret switch is used to kill the sword grunt and make the red warp path easier, it is not used to acquire coinz.
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Post by ILoveGruntz on Jan 29, 2008 8:52:48 GMT -8
Here is a suggestion: level | Coins | Size | number of puzzlez | difficulty | Status | 1.1 | 4 | 60X60? | 5 | Very Easy | Not made | 1.2 | 6 | 60X60? | 6 | Very Easy | Beta testing | 1.3 | 8 | 60X60? | 8 | Easy | Being designed by [Designer] | 1.4 | 10 | 60X60? | 8 | Easy | Ready for use |
Why not make a complete table of levels to be made, what they should contain and their status, so that every designer engaged can make the level fit perfectly to the place in the story. Some of the levels could be modified CL'z, but I agree that it is better to make new levelz for this project.
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Post by SwordGrunt on Jan 29, 2008 9:52:12 GMT -8
Here is a suggestion: level | Coins | Size | number of puzzlez | difficulty | Status | 1.1 | 4 | 60X60? | 5 | Very Easy | Not made | 1.2 | 6 | 60X60? | 6 | Very Easy | Beta testing | 1.3 | 8 | 60X60? | 8 | Easy | Being designed by [Designer] | 1.4 | 10 | 60X60? | 8 | Easy | Ready for use |
Why not make a complete table of levels to be made, what they should contain and their status, so that every designer engaged can make the level fit perfectly to the place in the story. Some of the levels could be modified CL'z, but I agree that it is better to make new levelz for this project. IMHO, the size you mentioned should be reduced. 60X60 is often used for High Rollerz and Honey, I Shrunk the Gruntz!.
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Post by ILoveGruntz on Jan 29, 2008 11:38:37 GMT -8
I know, I simply wrote a random number...
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GooRoo
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Post by GooRoo on Jan 29, 2008 14:22:42 GMT -8
But in RR stage 4, the secret switch is used to kill the sword grunt and make the red warp path easier, it is not used to acquire coinz. True, but nothing was acquired in order to accomplish that, and (as you stated) it only makez the puzzle easier when playing in 'normal' mode ... the puzzle may still be solved without the Secret. I am simply saying that any Secret cannot have an enemy Grunt go someplace (and be stuck) that the solver's Grunt cannot reach ... or acquire a Shovel required to dig up something (like the Warpstone) or remove an obstacle (such as a Hole); or Gauntletz to do a similar thing. Simply stated, "no Object other than the Warp letter or Coin(z) may be acquired via a Secret". No Tool, Toy or PowerUp ... no CoveredPowerup containing a Switch which clearz a path ... nothing that requirez the solver to use the Secret in order to be able to complete the puzzle and bring the Warpstone to the King. Put another way, each candidate replacement Level must be playable in 'Easy' mode (no " PERFECT!" score possible, but can bring the Warpstone to the King).
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Reece
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Post by Reece on Jan 30, 2008 8:10:19 GMT -8
Oh and in trouble in tropicz (i forgot which level ) you can obtain an extra pair of guantletz.Sorry i get it now, a level which needz you to get to the end via a secret path like my 'Im a grunt get me outta here CL'
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GooRoo
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Post by GooRoo on Jan 30, 2008 11:09:26 GMT -8
A very simple way to determine an appropriate size for a "Gruntz 2" Standard Level is to load the corresponding "Gruntz" Standard Level and then do a "Save as..." ... then modify the new puzzle by clearing the map and deleting the Objectz. The Statz Page imagez I am linking in will then tell you an appropriate number of Statz Page Objectz you should have in the CL (which will become a "Standard Level" in the "Gruntz2.REZ" file).
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Post by SwordGrunt on Jan 30, 2008 11:18:28 GMT -8
A very simple way to determine an appropriate size for a "Gruntz 2" Standard Level is to load the corresponding "Gruntz" Standard Level and then do a "Save as..." ... then modify the new puzzle by clearing the map and deleting the Objectz. The Statz Page imagez I am linking in will then tell you an appropriate number of Statz Page Objectz you should have in the CL (which will become a "Standard Level" in the "Gruntz2.REZ" file). Yes, that'd be the best way. We may slightly modify the Statz, but no absurd changez. And thanks for uploading the SLz to the host, GooRoo. Easier than extracting some filez from the Gruntz.Rez
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BattlezM
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Post by BattlezM on Jan 30, 2008 15:38:10 GMT -8
A very simple way to determine an appropriate size for a "Gruntz 2" Standard Level is to load the corresponding "Gruntz" Standard Level and then do a "Save as..." ... then modify the new puzzle by clearing the map and deleting the Objectz. The Statz Page imagez I am linking in will then tell you an appropriate number of Statz Page Objectz you should have in the CL (which will become a "Standard Level" in the "Gruntz2.REZ" file). I don't think it matterz how large the level is, so long as it fitz the difficulty. After all "Golf Anyone?" was a very small level for being in the 7 th world.
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GooRoo
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Post by GooRoo on Jan 30, 2008 15:48:57 GMT -8
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Post by SwordGrunt on Jan 30, 2008 16:48:20 GMT -8
Yes, the size of the existing Gruntz Standard Levelz is merely a quideline to a good size. A dense map (such as Gamer frequently designed) would result in a small map size, but still a high degree of difficulty. I think the supplied "Standard Levelz" were well done in the increasing difficulty, without any huge jumpz in difficulty. And almost every one had exactly two Secretz ... one SecretTeleportTrigger, and one Secret Switch. There were not so many Coinz to acquire, but tended to be more as the solver moved through the puzzlez. Certainly, "1000 Coinz" would not fit in that seriez. Almost? Is there any SL that doesn't have those 2 Secretz?
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